Encyclopedia Dramatica Is No More: OhInternet Rises from the Ashes

[Will Never]

The map story doesn't ring true.  I don't believe 9 out of 10 people cannot locate the USA on a map.  I don't even believe that 1 out of 10 people are unable to do that.  It sounds like one of those quirky made up "facts" that get spread around due to just being ridiculous.

[Tessera]

The map story doesn't ring true.

Are you accusing me of making things up, Will..? Because if you are, then I will take it as an insult and then act accordingly.

I do not invent these stories to entertain you -- I am providing accurate information to the best of my ability. It is not some "quirky story," as you've put it -- it was an actual test that was conducted in the early part of the past decade (around 2003 or so).

And I did not say "9 out of 10 people can't find the USA on a map." I said that when tested, almost 90 percent of modern inner city high school'ers were unable to find the USA on a map. In other words, an astonishing number of people in YOUR age bracket were unable to.

Most other folks would have had no trouble at all... probably because they actually LEARNED things in school, as opposed to simply plagiarizing it from the web and then printing it out as their "homework."

Know what I mean..?  

[Will Never]

The map story doesn't ring true.

Are you accusing me of making things up, Will..? Because if you are, then I will take it as an insult and then act accordingly.

I do not invent these stories to entertain you -- I am providing accurate information to the best of my ability. It is not some "quirky story," as you've put it -- it was an actual test that was conducted in the early part of the past decade (around 2003 or so).

And I did not say "9 out of 10 people can't find the USA on a map." I said that when tested, almost 90 percent of modern inner city high school'ers were unable to find the USA on a map. In other words, an astonishing number of people in YOUR age bracket were unable to.

Most other folks would have had no trouble at all... probably because they actually LEARNED things in school, as opposed to simply plagiarizing it from the web and then printing it out as their "homework."

Know what I mean..?  

People my age didn't have the internet throughout most of school.

I did not say you made it up.  I question this study or test's validity and results.  How do you even know it's real?  Were the results reproduced elsewhere?  In science, experiments need to be duplicated in more than one place in order to be valid.  I don't know anybody my age who doesn't know the location of the USA on a map. 

 

[Tessera]

I know it's real because I saw it on CNN, back when that test was conducted.

And then... like most things of this nature... they promptly stopped talking about it.

Because as I have already told you: the Establishment wants you to stay stupid, gullible and manipulable.

So by all means -- make their wish come true.

People my age didn't have the internet throughout most of school.

How old are you, Will..? And why are you arguing against shit that should be blitheringly obvious, even to a low-grade moron..? Because the internet has been widely available since the late 1980's. Hell... I remember signing up for CompuServe back around 1988. And a couple of years later, I also had GEnie, Prodigy and the very early America Online. The truth is that internet access has been widely available during your entire lifetime.

There is a reason for why you are called "the INTERNET generation," Will.  

[perez007usa]

The map thing, I not sure,,, but it was one of those beauty contest on TV where the host ask a question to the contestant, where a certain place that was on the map. They couldn't  do it, least  alone basic history.

[Tessera]

Well I don't know about any beauty contests... but the report that I saw had to do with researchers going into various high schools, in cities across the nation. They brought a map of the world with them, as I have described it: national borders were showing, but none of the countries had any labels on them. And then they asked the students to point to the USA on that map. The disturbing result was that 9 out of 10 of those students who were being tested did not point to the correct location on that map. Or maybe it was 6 out of 10... I honestly don't remember now. But in any case, about half of them pointed to Russia... and when asked why, they said "because it's the biggest country on the map, so it must be the USA."

[Schu]

That is just sad, thou I do agree that our governmental, corporate, military is partly to blame, I also blame the bureaucrats who think that a school system that's a hundred years old is going to suffice with a growing population. We have more and more students coming into the school system and fewer teachers every year. I mean come-on, when was the last time this country built a new elementary school or a high school. Thank the powers that be that I live in a small town where my kids can get a decent education.

[Cylnar]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJuNgBkloFE

This is a video of several Americans failing to name a country starting with a U, amongst other things. Just what Tessera said reminded me of this.

Now see... you could have asked me that question when I was 12 years old, and I would have immediately answered "Uruguay... Uganda... Ukraine."

Technically, when you were 12, Ukraine was a "Soviet Socialist Republic", not a country per se. Nor (for the same reason) was Uzbekistan, the third country besides "United States of America" and "United Kingdom" that I came up with while reading the question right now (the first two being Uganda and yes, Ukraine - Uruguay was number four).

[perez007usa]

Here are some of the beauty contest questions

  http://www.buzzle.com/articles/beauty-pageant-questions-and-answers.html

  http://lifestyle.in.msn.com/gallery.aspx?cp-documentid=3193112&page=1

  http://superl8tive.com/list/10015/worst-beauty-pageant-moment-videos

[Will Never]

In 2006, the National Geographic Society interviewed 510 young Americans -- people aged 18 to 24 -- about geography. Interviewers handed people a blank map of the world and asked them to identify various countries. "Nearly all (94 percent) young Americans can find the United States on the world map, and Canada (92 percent) and Mexico (88 percent) are nearly as familiar," the survey found.

So most young Americans, it turns out, can find America on the map.   I am thinking the 6% who can't are composed of people with mental illnesses or learning disabilities.  

Meanwhile...

A survey by the Gallup Organization found that one in seven adults can't find the United States on a blank map of the world.

Doesn't sound like high schoolers who have the difficulty to me.  According to what I'm reading, older adults less likely to be able to locate the USA, while high schoolers have more difficulty locating esoteric countries in the middle east.

So...yeah.  It seems like the "9 out of 10" study was falisified by those who conducted it, ... or that it used poor methodology.... or that memory is just failing people here.

[Will Never]

Here's the source by the way.

http://www.nationalgeographic.com/roper2006/pdf/FINALReport2006GeogLitsurvey.pdf

It's quite reputable and its methods are sound.  

[Tessera]

Alrighty Will... so then, how do you account for the discrepancy between the report that you are citing
from 2006, and the earlier CNN report from back around 2002..?

And what methodology did National Geographic use..? The researchers that I cited went to numerous
inner city high schools across the country. Did Nat. Geo. do the same thing..? Or did they just pop into
an upscale prep school one day and use those students as their subjects..?

Unless both sets of tests were conducted in exactly the same way, a comparison between them is pointless.

[Will Never]

Alrighty Will... so then, how do you account for the discrepancy between the report you are citing
from 2006, and the earlier CNN report from back around 2002..?

And what methodology did National Geographic use..? The researchers that I cited went to numerous
inner city high schools across the country. Did Nat. Geo. do the same thing..? Or did they just pop into
an upscale prep school one day and use those students as their subjects..?

Unless both sets of tests were conducted in exactly the same way, a comparison between them is pointless.

I'm not going to try and account for an (as far as I know) anonymous study that hasn't been documented here yet.   It's very unlikely that CNN conducted that study itself, since they don't do that sort of research.  Their research is farmed out and right now I have no idea where they extracted that information from.   Is there a publication of it avaliable somewhere?   

[Will Never]

If you are curious about NGs methods, it's under "C. Methodology...5" in the link I posted. 

It says: For the selection of households, interviewers followed randomly selected, pre-determined interviewing routes with skip intervals. At the household level, quotas for sex and age were applied for respondent selection.  All interviews were conducted face-to-face, in homes.  Respondents were not screened based on their general literacy level or their student status.  Nationally representative (excluding Alaska and Hawaii).  A randomly selected sample was designed to represent the target population nationally.  The assigned quotas reflect the structure of the population in the 18-24 age group.

Pretty standard, pretty legit.  They interviewed across the country and throughout all socioeconomic strata.  That makes for a better sample than your study which focuses on "inner city high school'ers" which is a rather biased sample to begin with, considering the racial make-up and funding of schools in the inner city. 

[Tessera]

Unfortunately Will, the people who are actually experts in this field do not agree with the assertions and denials that you are making, nor do they place any stock in the deceptive charts and graphs that you have been posting.

For example, here is a direct quote from Richard Arum, who is a sociology and education professor at New York University:

"Full-time college students spend 50 percent less time studying than they did several decades ago. We also know that in terms of grades, students expect to receive higher grades and do receive higher grades, in spite of less effort.

"You need to have developed these higher order skills: critical thinking, complex reasoning and the ability to communicate in writing. If you haven't, then you're going to be at a lifelong disadvantage in the economy. Equally or more troubling, if you're graduating large numbers of kids that have not developed critical thinking and complex reasoning, then how are they going to function as democratic citizens?"

Professor Arum wrote an entire book about this problem, in fact. It's called "Academically Adrift: Limited Learning on College Campuses." If you ever have the inclination to actually read a book, then you might consider picking up a copy. It is quite revealing and compelling reading.

And take note of the last sentence from that quote, because it jibes perfectly with the comments made by my own father... who is also a professional educator. To refresh your memory, my dad said "They've dumbed down the curriculum, in order to massage the statistics." Arum's last sentence further suggests that teachers are graduating young people who may very well not be properly educated... further supporting this "dumbing down of the curriculum" assessment. If this is indeed the case, then those charts and graphs of yours are absolutely worthless, because they depict what is -- essentially -- massaged data.


Or how about this quote, from U.S. Education Secretary Arne Duncan..? He's the guy who is actually in charge of keeping track of our education system...

"...this is a wake-up call. The country has stagnated educationally, putting our long-term economic security at risk. International Assessments of Student Achievement rankings show American 15-year-olds have fallen behind those in 31 countries in science and math."


And then we have the recent (2010) documentary "Waiting For Superman", which paints a very disturbing portrait of the downward trends within the American educational system... and how it has adversely affected an entire generation in particular (yours). Watch it sometime... if you can stomach it, that is.


So if I were you, then I would get on the phone right away to all of those experts and tell them just how wrong they are. Your internet generation peers are counting on you, Will.  

[Tessera]

So... shall I assume that my previous post in this topic has put an end to any more denials and debates..?

Including the false accusation that I somehow made up the statements from the US Dept. Of Education..?
Hopefully, posting a DIRECT QUOTE from the guy who is IN CHARGE of the US Dept. Of Education has
managed to clear up that little debate. And he said... in no uncertain terms... that American students
are in serious trouble. They have in fact fallen behind THIRTY-ONE OTHER COUNTRIES.

Fifty years ago, the USA was LEADING the world in the overall quality of our education.

My my, how times have changed.

So much for the denials... and the misleading charts and diagrams. Massaged data is not indicative of truth.