Windows 7 Retail -- EARLY REVIEW

[Tessera]

It more like the game plays in fast forward.

Then you'll need to run the game through an emulator.

[Tessera]

Well folks... I hate myself, but I have finally decided to take the plunge.

I just ordered the full retail version (not the "upgrade" version) of Windows 7 Ultimate.

I also ordered a brand-new enterprise class hard drive, to serve as my new boot drive.
I'll be installing Win7 to that drive. It's a 1-TB super-duper Western Digital model and it
looks quite solid to me. After being burned three times in a row by Seagate drives lately,
I won't be purchasing any more of their products. So I figured WD was a good choice.

May the lord have mercy upon my soul. And I still hate Bill Gates and I still think Windows
sucks as an operating system. But the industry is clearly going to force us to move into
this direction. I don't see any way to avoid it... at least, not for the next year or two.

I will continue to hope that Linux enjoys an increase in popularity. But until it does and
until that OS is better supported by hardware and software manufacturers, the only
major alternative to Windows... at least for gamers... is to switch over to a Mac.  

And I hate Macs.

[anariel]

You'll burn in hell... or did they got rid of the blue... I mean the red screen switching the color again? XDDDD

[Kandid]

I still can't decide. Can't make use of those student discounts, and it's too expensive. If I buy it and then I end up regretting the purchase... who knows what I'll have to do to Bill.

[Tessera]

...who knows what I'll have to do to Bill.

Does this provide you with any inspiration..?

[anariel]

Quite the soccer player, that girl. I would use something slow, not very sharp, but continous. And rusty, of course.

[Tessera]

We need a guy with a Spanish accent to shout "GOAL..!!!" every time she kicks him in the balls. 

[Cylnar]

Paging anariel...

[anariel]

I'm sorry, my english accent is a little more british... ^^U

[Tessera]

Here's some more feedback...

Okay, so I received my new copy of Win7 Ultimate today. And I also received my yummy new enterprise-class WD hard drive a couple of days ago.

So here I am, attempting to install the full retail version of Win7 Ultimate x64 onto my virgin 1 TB hard drive.

And the Windows 7 setup... which is incredibly slooooow, by the way... tells me that it can't install Win7 onto my new drive. Why..? Because the Win7 setup claims that my drive is either defective, or unable to serve as my boot drive for some unknown reason.

Bear in mind that this is a 100% new hard drive. It has never been used for a single thing in its entire young life.

So naturally, I'm sitting here thinking that Newegg has sent me a DOA drive and now, I'm gonna have to call them and RMA the fucker back to them for an exchange.

But then... I remembered something: that every version of Windows since Win2000 has been a pile of buggy, dysfunctional shit.

So, I told Win7 to fuck off... and I loaded my Windows XP x64 install disk into my DVD drive. Then, I rebooted and waited to see whether my earlier version of Windows would have the same problem with my brand new hard drive. If it does, then we know that I have a defective drive. Logical, yes..?

Well guess what..? Windows XP x64 had no trouble identifying, partitioning and quick formatting my new drive. No problems at all. It worked like a charm.

So ummm... what the fuck..?! Win7 tells me I have a defective drive... but an older version of Windows has no problems at all..?!

Way to go, Microslop. You've released another winner.

Anyway... after Win XP partitioned and formatted my new drive, I then went back to the Win7 x64 install disk. It no longer gave me any error messages and it is now installed. I am using it as we speak.

Consider this post to be a MAJOR bug report. If Windows can't correctly identify, partition and format a brand new hard drive, then its installation program is a dysfunctional piece of crap in my book.

I am not pleased. This glitzy fucking OS cost me 300 BUCKS, dammit. For that kind of money, it should have been fully bug tested prior to its official release. And this particular bug is MAJOR. If I hadn't had a different (and older) Windows install disk onhand, then I would still be pulling my hair out... trying to figure out what was wrong. I wonder how many people who are less computer-savvy than I am are going through an installation nightmare right now..?

Fuck you, Gates.  

[perez007usa]

I am not pleased. This glitzy fucking OS cost me 300 BUCKS, dammit. For that kind of money, it should have been fully bug tested prior to its official release. And this particular bug is MAJOR. If I hadn't had a different (and older) Windows install disk onhand, then I would still be pulling my hair out... trying to figure out what was wrong. I wonder how many people who are less computer-savvy than I am are going through an installation nightmare right now..?

Fuck you, Gates.   

   No thank you, I will still use WinXP ( have the x86 version, I'm looking for the x64) I don't have 300 bucks to blow. Looks like Gates is doing a fast one, like the game developers, sell faulty shit, take the money and run, or feed you by piece meal PATCHES to no end.

[anariel]

Mmm... Could it be possible to use an Ubuntu partition program for the same task and still use the disk to install a looser... I mean a Win7?

Would ask about our old fdisk command, but I think that old DOS executable can't handle 1TB disks ^^.

Hey... Maybe they are still using fdisk's code, and that's te reason...

[Tessera]

I just find it rather odd that Win XP could partition and format the drive... but Windows 7 didn't even try.

I thought the term "progress" meant that the newer stuff gets... ya know... BETTER than the older stuff..?

Not at MicroSlop, apparently. Every single version of Windows has been getting progressively worse,
ever since Win2000 (the last really good version of Windows ever made).

[Tessera]

More observations...


Well, I've had this spiffy new OS installed for about a week now. And I want to share something very important about Win7.

For 3-D gaming, Windows 7 "Ultimate" ABSOLUTELY SUCKS, performance-wise. Windows XP is MUCH faster than Win7 is.


In Win7, I'm noticing the following problems when gaming:

(1) Slower performace overall. Everything feels "sluggish."

(2) Lower framerates. Not by a lot... but it's significant.

(3) Noticeable input lag.

(4) Games suffer from numerous "mini-freezes" during gameplay. I don't know what else to call it, and I'm not the only gamer who has complained about this issue (I Google'd it). I'm simply getting a series of tiny freezes during gameplay which occur at random intervals. On some games, they are frequent. On other games, they are more rare. But this issue seems to be happening in -all- of my games, to varying degrees.

(5) Audio performance is spotty. Sometimes, Windows skips the first few milliseconds of a sound file that it is trying to play. I am told that Vista suffers from the exact same problem. Possibly DRM related.

(6) DirectX 11 also seems to be a potential culprit. Furthermore, I raised an eyebrow when I noticed that unlike previous versions of DirectX, there is no way to tweak the DX settings via the DXDIAG.EXE console. Hmmm.

(7) Fraps runs slower and causes A LOT more lag (as compared to WinXP) when capturing videos during gaming. I used to lose perhaps 5 FPS when using Fraps in Windows XP. Now, I'm losing more like 15 FPS (yes, I said FIFTEEN frames per second) when I activate Fraps video capture. Same version of Fraps... same computer.. same games... same video hardware... same everything, except for the OS. In WinXP, Fraps runs like a champ. But in Win7, it lags like a bastard. So the fault belongs with Windows 7.



I need to mention that my previous operating system -- Windows XP x64 -- did not suffer from any of the above issues. Compared to Windows 7, my old Windows XP x64 was noticeably faster in every single game that I own.

Fortunately, I didn't uninstall Windows XP when I decided to give Win7 a try. I didn't allow Win7 to set up a dual-boot configuration, either. I still have XP installed... on a totally separate hard drive. To switch back over to XP, I have my machine set up in such a way that I can select which hard drive to use for boot-up. I wired up a cool little power switch on my computer's front panel, which allows me to simply switch the power on and off to each of my main SATA hard drives. If I switch off the power to one SATA drive, then the machine simply boots from the other drive automatically. I did it this way because... well, because I frankly don't trust Microsoft and I didn't want Win7 to do anything to sabotage my XP x64 installation. So I kept the two operating systems completely separated from one another.

To sum up this post: Windows 7 Ultimate x64 sucks so bad for gaming that I frankly do not recommend it. Not for gamers, anyway. I will start looking for ways to tweak Win7 for better gaming performance... but I have the feeling that I won't discover much of anything that is effective. Because aside from all of the other things that I've mentioned, Win7 also seems to be the most cryptic, paranoid, invasive and downright dictatorial OS that I have ever seen in my life. I had to disable just about every single "enhancement" in Windows 7, before I could get it to behave in more or less the way that I wanted it to. It really is a bloated pile of unnecessary shit, frankly.

I'll post a follow-up if I discover anything helpful.

[tepesimpaled]

I've had mixed results with Windows 7.  I have 64bit Ultimate on my desktop and 32bit Professional on my laptop.  I will be keeping Windows 7 on my desktop which is actually triple boot (Windows XP, Windows 7 and Kubuntu).  My laptop (DELL Inspiron E1505) I'll be going back to Windows XP because the sound hardware (Sigmatel) and video hardware (Mobility Radeon x1400) do not have Windows 7 drivers. 

With my desktop (Phenom II x4, Radeon 4850x2 and GTX 8800 for PhysX) Windows 7 has been perfectly fine for gaming.  I've played Mirrors Edge, Bio Shock, UT3, Batman AA, Oblivion, Mass Effect and most Valve games a lot with none of the problems of "mini freezes", input lag or any other you mentioned Tessera. 

and yes I too miss DXdiag. 

[Tessera]

I suspect that the "mini-freezes" are happening due to poor built-in support for AMD dual-core processors. I've been poking around on the web... and so far as I can tell, the majority of similar complaints about Win 7 are coming from AMD users (like me).

Also, my mobo uses the nForce 4 chipset. There isn't any native support built into Win 7 for that chipset, nor does nVidia support it anymore (even though the nForce 4 chipset is only four years old). I think that is what is causing the input lag, hard drive issues and so forth on my machine.

All in all, I think Windows 7 sucks rat balls. It's yet another trashy OS that seeks to force us all into buying several thousand dollars worth of new hardware, before it will perform properly. And there also seems to be a very noticeable built-in bias towards Intel CPU's and nVidia graphics cards. More backroom deals, no doubt.  

I never bought Vista (lucky me), but the scuttlebutt on the web is telling me that Win 7 is only marginally better than Vista was. As a matter of fact, Windows 7 -is- Windows Vista. It's just masquerading under a different paint job. But at its heart, it is almost the exact same operating system as Vista.

Overall, Win 7 is a dog. I just switched my system back over to Win XP x64... and it's flying along like a champ. I'm using it right now, in fact... and my computer is once again performing at its (nearly) full potential.

The bottom line for me is gaming performance... not bells and whistles and a slew of needless yummy bits. Win XP x64 is not only faster for gaming than Win7... it is ENORMOUSLY faster. It's like a night and day difference. I don't even need to benchmark it... because you can see the difference quite plainly in front of your face. Faster framerates, less glitches, sharper graphics and MUCH less lag overall.

It amazes me that Microslop hasn't learned their lesson yet. They seem intent on bullying the rest of us into doing it their way... or else. Well, my answer to them is a simple one: keep this shit up, and you can fully expect to see an enormous number of Windows users switching over to Macs and Linux systems in the near future.

As for me, I've had it with Win7. What a total waste of 300 dollars. But hey... I had to know. And at least this way, whenever I rave against Win 7, I can state with confidence that I know exactly what I'm talking about.

Welcome back, WinXP Pro x64. I missed ya.  

[tepesimpaled]

You pretty much nailed what Windows 7 is on the head, it is a "new" OS for "new" hardware.  It "works" the way it should on my new machine because it is 3 months old.  I can see the nForce chipset being a source of some problems.  I used to like them, but after the 2 series I started to just use VIA chipsets or AMD ones. 

Windows 7 having a nVidia bias would be something hard to argue.  Yes Vista, or rather DX10 had a big bias for nVidia, but that was marginalized with DX10.1 and soon DX11 could reverse the bias.  I hope DX11 sticks as well as DX9 has.  DX10 was a big mess with its unhappy marriage with Vista.  We will just have to wait and see.

All I know, I'm glad that I have a MSDNAA account to get Windows 7 Professional for free and Ultimate for $30.  Like I said, with my laptop it is back to WinXP, but my main desktop Windows 7 will probably remain the main OS.  Oh I wish *nux gaming was a real option.

[Tessera]

You pretty much nailed what Windows 7 is on the head, it is a "new" OS for "new" hardware.

Yes... but even on new hardware, Windows XP outperforms Windows 7. That series of benchmark scores that I listed in my OP (which were originally posted by CNET) were taken on a brand new machine... not an older one. And the scores for WinXP were consistently better than the scores for Vista and Win7.

So the real issue is: how much better would your new computer function with Win XP..? Sure... if you have raw brute force, then the performance issues inherent in Vista and Windows 7 might seem marginal. But the question still remains of exactly -why- Vista and Win7 perform noticeably slower as compared to WinXP. In my view, slower performance and a more restrictive environment do not represent "progress." Indeed, it comes across to me as being a much more unresponsive and downright dictatorial operating system, which at times leaves the user feeling as if we no longer have a say in the operation of our own computer. Why the hell would anybody want something like that..? Because it's "more secure..?"

Right... security. Uh huh. Allow me to be a tad pompous for a moment...

As the great Benjamin Franklin once said, "Those who would sacrifice liberty in exchange for security will deserve neither -- and lose both." That's actually a fitting description of the direction Microsoft has been taking with its more recent versions of Windows. Performance, flexibility and responsiveness are gradually being replaced with "security features" which go so far as to lock the user out of his own computer at times (I'm referring to restricted file access and so forth). Every time I click something in Windows 7 with my mouse, I end up having to wait for a few seconds... whilst Windows decides whether or not I am trying to do something that Microsoft approves of. I honestly feel as if Bill Gates just moved into my basement... and he refuses to leave.

Well, to hell with that. My computer is not a toy. My computer is a tool. And I want it to perform up to its full capabilities. I built it myself, and I spent a bundle on its components. But as soon as I fire up Windows 7, I have to sit there and watch a substantial percentage of its power being wasted upon bells, whistles, DRM schemes and endlessly redundant security checks. I suppose if I was working for the Department of Defense, then all of that crappola would be understandable. But I'm not involved in anything like that... I'm just a regular guy, who wants a reliable operating system that takes a back seat to my games and other applications.

Windows 7 is by far the worst OS that I have ever used for gaming, period. I'm told that Vista was worse... but I wisely stayed away from Vista. I had hoped that Microsoft had learned their lesson, after all of the complaints about their horrible Vista OS... but obviously, they haven't learned anything at all. In all of the areas that count the most, Win7 is just as bad as Vista was reported to be. That goes double for gamers, regardless of what kind of hardware you own. No matter how fast Win7 may be on your machine, I can promise you that WinXP x64 will be faster at performing the same tasks... no matter what.